How Great Teams Ride the Rhythm of Work | #30

Welcome to Unleash youh Impact, Unlock Others, a podcast about inspiring leadership. We hope to bring you grounded wisdom, stories from real leaders and leave you feeling inspired. Let's dive in.

Welcome to Unleash youh Impact, Unlock Others. This episode is a leadership unscripted episode where we're going to talk about leading in flow, how great teams ride the rhythm of work.

And in this episode, Richard and I are going to explore a new way of thinking about team performance, not just from the perspective of the leader, but from everybody who is in the team. So it's not just about roles and responsibilities. It's through the whole flow of the team and how the team works together.

And we're going to talk to you about different flow stages that the team needs to go through and the associated leadership styles that apply to each of those stages.

And Rich will help me unpack how great leaders assess where their team is now, what's needed next, and particularly how to flex the style in the moment. Now you'll hear about the rhythm of the team momentum through four key terms.

The ignite, the inspire, the enable and the execute stage of how teams work together and why misalignment or missing styles can stall progress in the team. And we'll bring real examples.

And Richard's got a lovely music studio inspired metaphor to share with you as well, and some practical insights to bring this episode to life and help leaders diagnose their teams more effectively and lead with intention and not just leave it to autopilot. So, Rich, welcome to the podcast as per usual.

Thanks, Dave. Good to see you again.

How are you feeling today?

I'm okay, actually. Yeah. Looking forward to August and holidays and all that sort of stuff.

So I'm fully inspired today because I watched the women win the Euros last night, and I think that was really, really interesting. Actually, there's a whole podcast for another day on how brilliant the leadership in that team is, but we'll leave that for another day.

But, you know, in terms of teams working in flow, what a brilliant exhibition that was last night of teams working together in flow.

Okay, fantastic. Yeah, yeah. Brilliant. Yeah. Congratulations to the England team as well.

Absolutely right. So let's talk a bit about what we mean by great teams riding the rhythm of work.

So I've just in the introduction there said about some team momentum stages and how timing and agility and leadership style are often overlooked and so important. Do you just want to unpack that a little bit more for me and just say why this is so important?

Yeah.

So alongside this podcast episode, we're going to post on our website a simple graphic which will summarize in our connected leadership model how these, if you like, four stages of flow map onto our connected leadership model. So we'll explain it verbally but you'll probably benefit from downloading that. So please go to our website to do that.

But I just very quickly just want to go back to our connected leadership model which is a four quadrant model with a compass if you like, going through cutting through each of those quadrants. And in the top right hand corner we have the bold captain. So this is the person, if you like, who's the energizer, the visionary and the challenger.

In the top left hand corner this is the inspiring navigators. So they share the visionary style with the bold captain but they're the innovator and they're the collaborator.

The bottom left hand corner is what we call the care and shepherd. So this is the team member who is the harmonizer and the coach. And again they share the collaborator style with the inspire and navigator.

So you can see like it almost goes round anti clockwise and all these stars are interlinked together and we to the final Persona which is what we call the diligent builder. And they're the person that's, they're the organizer, they're the challenger and they share the coaching style with the caring shepherd.

So what we've done is we've mapped on what we call team flow stages to that connected leadership model.

So imagine that anti clockwise model that I just described and what we're going to be talking about, what happens when a new team is formed or where a team initiates a project and we're going to think about the flow stages that the team will go through. So that in essence is a very quick summary of sort of where we're going.

Yeah, I think it's really important for teams to understand where they are in that flow, isn't it?

Yes, absolutely.

And whether they get stuck in a certain part of that flow, what's stopping them moving on to the next part of that flow.

Yeah, yeah. Because essentially this is about team diversity.

So if you've got a really diverse team that if have access to all of those different stars and Personas, hopefully you'll have a team where all of that is really well covered and you'll go through the natural flow stages without getting too stuck.

But if you lack diversity in the team or you've got a very sort of dominant team leader where there's obvious gaps if you like, in their style, it's possible that you can get stuck in some of those flow stages. Hence the reason why projects sometimes get stuck or teams sort of get stuck a little bit in terms of their.

The way they form and get to a sort of high performing stage.

And as I said in my introduction, you know, it's not about having one leader of this team who has got all of these behavioral styles, you know, 100%. Actually, the best leaders may not have that, but they're really good at finding people in their team who can fill the gaps for them.

And I think that's a really important part of this conversation today, isn't it?

Yes, yes, it is. Yeah. And I think that, you know, I think that would bring me on nicely to the analogy of the. The music mixer or the production mixer.

So did you want me to talk?

Please do.

So I think I might have mentioned before, but I'm really passionate about music. Yeah, we share that, Dave, don't we? A passion for music.

We do. The difference is you can play it and I can't.

Yeah, well, yes, I guess that might be true. So actually I'm sat in my studio at the moment and I have around me all my synthesizers and musical instruments.

And I do, as a, as a keen amateur, I do recording of music. And in, in my studio I have what. What we call in the production world a mixer.

So in other words, all my instruments, all my different synthesizers go into this mixer and the mixer has all these channels. You probably. Have you seen the, the mixers on a. In studios.

You've probably seen it on TV or something like that where you have all these like, if you like channels or they look like columns with sliders on it.

And each one of those channels represents like an instrument or a vocal mic or a drum going into the mixer and you set the channel level, those sliders on the channel, and you mix all the different instruments together. So what you'll see is for different parts of a musical song, say, for example, you might say, okay, we need the guitars a little bit louder here.

So you'll raise the channel for the guitar. So you'll move the slider up. Or maybe the synthesizers are too loud for this, you know, for the chorus.

And you move the slider for the synthesizers down in that particular stage of the song. So as a song goes through all its stages, you know, the verse and the chorus and the middle eight, you'll adjust the sliders to match the song.

Okay, so using this. It's a very good analogy, Rich, actually, I think to use for this what it strikes me just listening to you talk about that.

And yes, I do know what one of these mixing desks visually looks like. Yeah, it's a real skill to use it, I'd imagine. I'm not, I'm not a music production engineer. Yeah, it must have real skill to use it.

And it's actually quite complex in terms of all the little bits of mixing you can do and how you blend things together, which I guess is a good analogy for what being a really good leader is all about.

Yeah. And if you think about in the context of a team and these team flow stages. So imagine the flow stages is different parts of the song.

So for different parts of the song, you'll need different instruments to come up and down in the mix. Okay. And for the different stages, as a team, go through, say a project initiation through to project execution.

For each of the stages that we're going to talk about those styles, those eight styles that I talked about, the pacesetter, visionary, innovator, collaborator, harmonizer, coach, organizer and challenger. You'll need those different styles in different ways at different stages.

So a skillful team, skillful team members, self aware team members, a skillful leader will make sure all those styles are nuanced to the different stages that you're in.

So let's dive into this team flow stages model then. Rich, where do we start? I guess we start with the obvious one, Ignite. We need to spark momentum in a team, don't we?

Like you, it could be a new team that's forming or it could be a team that's already intact but starting a new project.

Yes. Yeah.

So we need to ignite the team. We need to spark momentum, we need to create some urgency to find some goals, activate some people.

So just want to bring that to life for me a bit more.

Yeah. So we've mapped this ignite stage over the top of what we call the bold Captain Persona.

Okay, so this is the top right of our model as we were talking about just now.

And if you like the three styles, the three, if you like the three channels, the three fader mixers are the Energizer, the visionary and the challenger style. Okay. Now we're going to come to the challenger right at the very end after we've gone through round the whole, the whole model.

But here particularly, what we need is to get the project going or to get the team initiated. You need somebody who's going to be the pacesetter that's going to generate the urgency, is going to initiate and activate and Start the process.

And also alongside that is to rally the people around a vision. So this is where we're going. So to push people and to point in the direction that we're going to. So this is the ignite stage.

So if you think, actually imagine you're a team member, going to ask our listeners to think about, you know, you must be a member of a team. Probably most people are if they're listening to this podcast. Who in the team is the person that's the natural igniter?

If you like, the person that naturally will step forward, be quite assertive and push to get things started? That might be that you might be the person that brings those stars, the pacesetter, the visionary and the challenger.

You might bring those stars to bear inside the team or you might look to other people.

But the point is, if your team lacks that igniter, a sort of style, if you like, it might be actually that the team gets stuck right at the very beginning.

Is it safe to assume that a lot of times the leader of the team is seen as being the person who can do this? They don't have to be and they don't need to be. But often do we wait for our leader of our team to be that person?

Because sometimes it's not their natural style to do that.

No, no, it's not.

And actually I've worked and coached with leaders who actually are aware that the ignite, you know, being the paces or in the visionary, that's not their natural, that's not their natural way of being as a leader. So they delegate that to other people in the team.

So for example, you know, this, there's somebody I've coached, they ask their team members to take it in turns to chair a meeting, for example, to chair their team meetings. And I think that's a really powerful way to engage team members, to delegate and to empower people.

And a really self aware thing to do, really, I think. But the point is, you know, teams need to get started, they need to initiate.

Yeah, absolutely. Okay, so that's the first part of this model. That's the first part of the team flow. The next phase is what we call the inspire stage.

So this is about aligning everybody behind that vision that you've created. It's about exciting them about that vision. So there might be a bit of refining of the vision going on here.

We certainly want to start exploring ideas and engaging various stakeholders in the conversation. So do you want to just talk about that bit more, Rich for me?

Yeah. So this aligns to our inspire and navigator Persona in our connected leadership model.

So this leans more towards engaging the people, as you said, engaging the people and getting them rallied behind your vision and your strategy.

Because it's all very well, you know, being, being quite directive and getting things started and being very clear, this is where we go and point into the direction where we're going. Actually, what you want to do is to get the people engaged in that goal, engaged in that vision, and to get people inspired.

So if you like the three mixer channels aligned to our connected leadership styles, this is about the visionary again. But. But the nuance here is about actually engaging the people around that vision. So it's the visionary, the innovator.

So this is where actually you want. You want to engage people's ideas, you want to engage people's creativity, you want to engage your stakeholders, you know, so.

So that inn style is really key and that's linked to the collaborator style. That's really about, you know, building bridges and engaging.

So the visionary, innovator and collaborator styles all work together to pull people around the vision created.

And I guess in practice, this is the person who has this as their strong, natural way of working, who would always keep the big picture in focus. They would always make sure that team is aligned around that bigger picture.

Exactly. Yes.

Yeah, yeah, that's really important. As the project or the team moves on through this flow, you've got to keep that big picture in mind.

Otherwise you can disappear off into sort of levels of detail that actually don't help you. If you see what you mean.

Yes, yeah, exactly. Right. Yeah.

Okay, so we've talked about igniting as a stage. We're talking about then inspiring.

The next stage is to go onto the enable stage of the team flow, which is about building trust within the team and capability within the team to deliver it. So it's about supporting the team dynamics. You might naturally get conflict as well. So it's about resolving conflict where that arises.

And it's about coaching and connecting people, isn't it? I mean, we've done a podcast on coaching before.

This is about coaching and connecting your team behind that vision that you've created the goals that you've got to achieve. So how does that play out, Rich?

Yeah, so if you think of the ignite and the inspire stage, aligned to the bold captain and inspire and navigator, as you said, you know, this very, very goal focused, very, very vision focused, you know, it's sort of pushing.

Although the inspiring navigator will want to engage people, actually what you want to do is once you've inspired the people to rally round your vision and your set of goals. You want to build the capability inside the team.

You want to create a sense of trust and harmony inside the team and get the team working together as a cohesive whole. So this enabling stage, I think, is a key aspect of the caring shepherd Persona. So going back to the mixer analogy again, so the three.

The three mixer channels for the enable stage, so it's about collaborating again. So that's shared with the inspire and navigator.

It's about harmonizing, being the harmonizer, and it's about coaching people, you know, so helping people to solve the issues and the challenges and the problems for themselves, as opposed to being the bold captain. The bold captain is often the person that tells and directs.

Actually, what you want to do is to create a real trusting environment where everyone has a voice, people feel that they can share their mistakes and their failures, and you create this sense of togetherness and trust. And people can be vulnerable inside the team as well.

So, you know, even though you might have conflicts and difficult conversations to have this enable stage, that the caring shepherd Persona is a really key element in keeping the team together.

Yeah. And to go back to my initial comments about the Lionesses football team, this applies to any sporting team, actually.

Most of the best sporting teams will have a vision of what they want to achieve. They'll set some goals of what they want to achieve, so they'll go through that ignite and inspire phase.

But when you get to the enable phase, I think that culture of psychological safety where you allow people, within the confines of what you're trying to achieve, to express themselves naturally. And they might do some things wrong, but that's okay. That's actually really important in this whole team flow, isn't it?

People can express themselves naturally. Yeah.

Yeah. So I didn't watch the football at the weekend, but you watched the football and have followed it all the way through.

So who's the manager of the England team again, did you say?

A lady called Serena Vegman who is, I think, and say it's a podcast, maybe for another day. I think she embodies everything that we mean by being a connected leader. And I think she's.

If you look at the various Personas of bold captain, inspiring navigator, caring shepherd and diligent builder, I think she naturally flexes through all of them. So I think she's a really good example, and I think we'll have another podcast on how I see that playing out.

Okay. Yeah, yeah.

But, yeah, I think in that sporting context, and it's probably true in a business context. Allowing people within certain confines to express themselves, that takes real trust. And you've got to have a trusted culture to be to do that.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you do, absolutely. You do. Yeah.

Okay. So that's the enable phase and then the final phase of this team flow is the execute. We've got to deliver outcomes ultimately.

So we have to implement things, we have to systemize things, we have to challenge people to deliver excellence and deliver their best. This is where the final Persona, the Diligent Builder, comes in.

So do you want to unpack that one for me, Rich, in terms of how this plays out in the team flow?

Yeah. So as you said, you know, this execute stage is key to, you know, this is by getting stuff done, basically.

Yeah, yeah.

So the three mixer channels associated with this execute stage, it's about coaching and the coaching style for the Diligent Builder, it's probably got a slightly different nuance than the care and shepherd. So this is about coaching people or mentoring people to get things done, basically.

So the Diligent Builder leans more towards the challenge side of our connected leadership model. So it's building the capability to get things done through coaching. It's about systematizing and organizing.

So that's the organizer style that we've talked about.

So making sure you got your processes, your procedures, your quality threshold, all that stuff, you know, that's important part of being the organizer and you really need that, you know, to get stuff done inside a team. Which leads us into the final style, which I'll come to in a minute, the challenger style.

Because this is quite a pivotal style in this model, so brings the whole model together. So we have the ignite, inspire, enable and execute in this sort of anti clockwise sort of model that pulls all those styles in a nuanced way.

So really good teams sort of raise and lower the faders as they go through each of these stages. And to be fair, you know, you know, projects are messy. Team environments can change all the time.

So it might be that you go backwards and forwards between these different stages, but the best teams, you know, flexes all of those styles in a really skillful way.

Well, I think you made a really important point there because.

And I do implore people to go and download the graphic from our website because you'll, it'll bring it to life, especially for a visual learner like me. You'll like that.

But I think if you just imagine Richard's talking about going from the top right hand corner of our model where it's the ignite phase of this team. Flow through Inspire, through Enable and onto Execute. That isn't always a linear process.

I think that's the point you just made, and I think it's a really important process, actually. Sometimes you've got to flex back and forward in this.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.

And depending what the project is and why the team is set up in the first place, a good skillful leader has to constantly be flexing around these team flow stages.

So broadly, that's the four stages a team has to go through, but depending on the situational context, you might have to go back and forth a fair few times.

Yeah.

And I think the other important thing to say for each of those four stages, the Ignite, Inspire, Enable and Execute, for the three associated connected leadership styles, depending on the context and the situation, for those three, say the three stars in the ignite stage, the visionary, pacesetter and challenger, you might set the levels of those relative stars very slightly differently, depending on the context.

Yeah.

You know, do you see what I mean? So it might be actually that you need more of the visionary at this stage, less of the pacesetter.

You don't need so much of the challenger at this stage.

And it's about skillfully flexing to make sure, actually, in the ignite stage, are you doing the right things to get this project or get this team off the ground?

Yeah. And I couldn't see it in my own experience. I'm just thinking of a leadership role that I have with my tennis club, where I was very much.

When I took over as being the men's captain in my tennis club, there was a lot of stuff to sort out that wasn't working. So. And it's my natural style, as you said before, to be a bit of a bold captain and a bit of an inspiring navigator.

So I definitely was initially the person that ignited a change I certainly set. I energized the whole change and brought a bit of a vision together.

Yes.

But very clearly I had to move on to the Inspire stage because I needed to get people on site with me to make it a reality. So the collaboration bit for me was really, really important. Who is going to share my vision? Who has got skills? The skills and the.

And I guess the gravitas and, you know, whatever to help me bring us to life. So I think for me, that was really key because once I had some really good collaborators on board, they start to do a lot of the work for you.

Actually.

You haven't got to do everything. Yeah.

So it Sounds like for the ignite and the inspire stage, actually you had the pace setter really high on the mix.

Yeah.

And the collaborator up really high in the mix. Doesn't mean the other styles weren't used, but they were slightly lower in the mix because that was in that context, that's what you needed.

Absolutely. Those were the two key things I had to do. Get it started, get some energy behind it, start to go in a new direction.

But I knew that the collaboration bit was going to be the key thing to do once you've got some good collaborators.

In reality, I'm talking about here team captains that help me do the job, captain various teams and also the coaching teams that were going to actually help us deliver. Those were really key. There were some other people as well. So when you get onto the execute stage, it makes it much, much easier.

Yes, yeah. And I think the important thing about this model, we often talk about diverse by design teams.

So when you recruit people into your team, think about actually what do they bring in terms of their natural styles. So you can use the connect to leadership model to think about actually do we need more harmonizers or organizers inside this team actually right now.

And it gives you a model to think about actually what do we do to harness the team diversity and then once you've got diversity in the team, how do we then flex to the different situations?

So, Rich, everyone has style preferences. I think we've said this before, that's quite natural. We have our own preferences. Yeah.

But the issue with preference is not the preference itself, it's the lack of awareness and conscious judgment around the preference. So if we're going to look at how, what part do we play in this team flow? Go back to what we said in many podcasts before.

You need to build some levels of self awareness about where you are naturally.

Exactly.

And how you can consciously adjust your behavior for the benefit of the team.

Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

And I say those words very carefully, not for the benefit of yourself, but for the benefit of the team.

So there's just one more part of this model, one more layer, if you like, that I just want to add to what we said already. So think about the four stages we talked about going in an anti clockwise direction. Ignite, inspire, enable and execute.

Actually what then happens is you've done the execution and actually in this model you go back around the cycle again. But the key bit, the key nuance to this model, and I think this is what makes our model a little bit different from some of the other team models.

That we've seen around is right between that execute and ignite stage, you know, so right between the Diligent Builder and the Bold captain is this shared challenger style.

Okay, so I want you to think now just, I just want to focus on this challenger style because I want you to imagine the challenger style is the key transition between executing and then going back around the cycle. Because all good teams do lessons learned.

If you think about the Agile process, that's talked about quite a lot actually, what Agile proposes is we do things in small steps in projects and then do regular lessons learned as we go. Okay.

Yeah.

And with lessons learned, what you do is you look back at what you've done and you challenge yourself to think, actually, what would we do differently next time? What do we do? Well, that we need to build on, but what would we do differently next time?

So actually inside a team, the person sometimes that could be seen as the awkward customer, we all know, perhaps we've been in teams where we've had the awkward team member that constantly seems to be the negative voice in the team. Actually this is a really good way to engage that style, that team member in a really positive way. So think about.

Actually from time to time, as a team, you'll need to go back around the cycle to stop sense, check where you are to do a lessons learned. So in other words, to challenge and then to go back around the cycle.

Yeah. You've got to almost reignite the team, haven't you?

Yes.

And there'll be some good reasons for that. Because you might have new team members, you might have a slightly different focus for the project because things have moved on.

There'll be lots of reasons why you have to reignite.

Yes, exactly. Yeah. And to go back to the music mixer analogy, you think about the way songs develop and I talked about different stages in the song.

So you tend to have a verse and then you have a chorus, and then you have a verse and then you have a chorus. And then sometimes in songs you have what's called the middle eight.

So this is the part of the song that just introduces something a little bit different, Almost like sets up a little bit of tension inside the music and then it often then leads to like a recap of the chorus. Yeah.

So a middle eight would be a screaming guitar solo, would it? Would that?

Yes. Well, it could be. Yes, it could be. You know, so it creates a tension.

It creates like almost like a pause point in the song and then you go back around and you go around and you go around the chorus and this is what the challenger star does. It, you know, almost like, right, let's take stock of where we are and actually allow those voices in the room.

And, you know, it could be led by a natural challenger, but making sure, actually, as a team, you do challenge what you've done, build, build on what you've done well, but actually to learn to go back around the cycle, because the best teams do what they call double loop learning. You know, actually they do a sense check of what's gone well and what they could do different.

I think, again, you made another really important point there about. So once you've done the first sort of flow through and you're reigniting the team to go again. And this challenger style is really, really important.

Now, that may be that the team leader. The leader of that team is the natural challenger, but it actually doesn't hurt.

And this is probably best practice inside the team for rather than just being the person that does the challenging to invite the team to challenge as well.

Exactly, exactly.

It's not about one person. It never is about one person. I think the most confident leaders, the ones are a bit more humble, will say, actually, no. What are the lessons learned?

Challenge me. I have a view, but challenge me on my view. I want to hear what you think.

Yeah, that's.

That's the emotionally intelligent version of the challenger, isn't it?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. To use the analogy that you used just now, the screaming guitar solo.

So imagine actually on, you know, you get to that point in the song and you move the slider for the screaming guitar solo. You move it up. Yeah, okay.

But actually, at the same time, you know, as the song builds and the tension builds, you want to bring the drums up as well, and you want to bring the bass up and you want to bring the, you know, so. So you're engaging all of the voices, but it's led by the guitar, you know, so. And then it leads into the next part of the song.

Yeah. So if you're a leader of a team, you don't have to be the guitar, the drums, the bass, the keyboard, and sing the song as well.

You don't have to do it all. That's the point you're making, isn't it? No, actually, I'm good at singing, but I'm not very good at playing the bass guitar or the keyboard.

But we have got some people in this team that are very, very good at that. Let's allow them to do that as part of this process. No, it's a good analogy, Rich. Yeah.

Okay, so in terms of mixing the styles and filling the style gaps, is there any other points that you wanted to make before we move on?

No, I think that covers off most of the things now. So I think we just need to. To move on to what are the key takeaways, I think.

Okay, so just to recap what Richard said there, you know, in a team, we need to notice what our team's dominant style is. We need to notice what roles the individuals naturally play in the team.

We need to look for whatever we are involved in as a team, what's missing for any given stage of work that you're involved in.

And ultimately, whether you're the leader of that team or a leader within that team, you need to flex your style accordingly for whichever phase that you're in. I think. I think that's really important to say as a. As a sort of summary. Yeah.

Okay, so in terms of wrapping this up, then, Rich, key takeaways, key points you want to make for people listening and thinking, wow, this is a different way of looking at team flow. I quite like this as a way of looking at team flow. What are the key things I should be thinking about?

I think there's a couple of ways to think about this model so you could, you know, if you've got a new project coming along, you can use this model to map best practice in terms of how you might engage with the projects and get things started.

So think about how you're going to ignite this, how you're going to inspire people, get people rallied around the vision, how are you going to build the capability and enable the team and how you're going to execute. So that gives you a nice model to think about the flow.

But actually, if you think about the way teams operate, there's stuff going on all the time, different challenges coming in and out.

So you can ask yourself, you know, what stage, what's the dominant stage that we're in right now, you know, in terms of the key challenges that face us, what's the dominant stage that we're in?

And then think about, if you like, the mixing panel of the team, you know, what stars are loudest in the mix right now and is that appropriate for this context? And maybe what's missing? So it gives you a metaphor and an analogy to think about actually.

How can we harness the diversity in the team and how we can bring our self awareness and the awareness of the team to flex to your different situations. Yeah.

And ultimately achieving things in life. Whatever walk of life you operate in is about behavior. So what I like about the model we're talking about is it's about behavior.

So I think you're right. I think one of the ways you can use this is in a reflective way to think, okay, what behaviors am I seeing in this team right now?

And are those behaviors helpful to what we're trying to do, or are these behaviors unhelpful in holding us back and go a stage further then thinking? Okay, well, behavior is often driven by thinking.

So what's the psychological thinking going on in the individuals and the team as a whole, which is actually helping us or hindering us? There's a lot of layers to this. It's quite nuanced when you start to think about it.

And the final thing I'll say is, are you doing regular lessons learned?

Yeah.

Whether that's part of a project or, you know, just like mini issues that you've been addressing as a team or whatever that might be, are you taking time to regularly think about what do we do well that we can build on and actually what do we not do quite so well? So that requires vulnerability and humility. Yeah. That we can. That we can do differently next time.

So if you're there thinking, this has been an interesting take on team dynamics and you might be a part of a team that's been intact for quite some time. Have a think about the ignite stage. How ignited is your team at the moment? Do I need to reignite this team or does this team need reigniting?

So how do we energize the team? How do we make sure they've got the vision that they need and how do we challenge them to move forward?

You also need to think about how we collaborate and how we innovate in the team. Now, is that stagnated a bit in my team at the moment? Do I need to do a bit more of that? Who's harmonizing in the team? Who's coaching the team?

Who's making sure that we are enabled and have the capability to deliver? And finally, how do we execute? Who's organizing stuff?

Who is coaching, mentoring, as you said, Rich, and come back round again, who's challenging us to learn from what we're doing and try and do it even better next time?

That is, if you're in a team now and you're thinking, I'm not sure we're quite delivering in the way, we could use this as a way of sense checking where you're going. Right. But more importantly, where you could do better.

Exactly.

Okay, so this is the final podcast for this season.

That means Rich and I for the month of August will be having a little bit of holiday and won't be releasing new podcasts until the first week in September. But we are going to re release over the next three or four weeks some podcasts we've done earlier in the year, so look out for those.

But for this time, for the season two of our podcast, that's it. Rich and me.

Yeah. Thank you, Dave. I just to wish our listeners a happy summer and hope, you know, you, if you go on holiday, you have a great time.

Yeah. And we'll see you back for a brand new episode in September.

Thank you.

Thank you.