The Scotch Egg Secret: How Rhian Caffull Built a Purpose-Driven Brand from Scratch | #7

Welcome to Unleash youh Impact, Unlock Others, a podcast about inspiring leadership.

We hope to bring you grounded wisdom, stories from real leaders and leave you feeling inspired.

Let's dive in.

Anyone can have an idea.

Many people want to turn their idea into a business.

They want to formulate a mission statement and convert their vision into reality.

But to succeed at this requires a focus on habits, disciplines and most of all, bags of resilience.

Many of the curveballs and challenges that come your way will not be anticipated.

So imagine you're working as an expedition leader based in the Middle east and leading groups of of people on adventures to all four corners of the planet.

It's a job you love, a role you're great at, and it's aligned to your sense of purpose.

Then, without warning, a very large curveball comes your way.

A global pandemic that means no more expeditions, a very restrictive lockdown and ultimately redundancy.

You return to the UK with a period of quarantine and plenty of time to reflect on what next.

Today's guest on Unleash youh Impact, Unlock Others is business owner and entrepreneur Rianne Cafor.

Rianne's journey is an inspiring one for any leader who needs to be resilient in pursuing a vision.

The conversation with Rianne covered various topics, including the challenges of establishing and running a business, the impact of family dynamics and dealing with unwarranted online abuse.

Rianne shares her experiences, including her role as a teaching assistant and leading expeditions in Tanzania and Borneo, and dealing with student crises.

She discusses her transition to Dubai, her redundancy during the pandemic, and how she started again with an idea and a determination to do something meaningful and valuable for the world.

Her reflections on community spirit, on collaboration, resilience and confidence will resonate with leaders of both SMEs who are in their early stages of developing and in more established organisations who are getting to grips with navigating the perfect storm of economic uncertainty, shifting social attitudes and the increasing role that technology plays in our work lives.

Rhiannon is a purpose led, values driven leader who is smart, resourceful, humble, grounded and above all, very engaging to spend time with.

I hope you enjoy listening to her story and the insights she shares.

Let's dive in.

So welcome to Unleash youh Impact Unlock Others.

This is the second in our Voices of Leadership interviews and today I'm joined by the wonderful Rhiann Kaful.

Hello Rhianne, how are you?

Hello.

Good, thank you.

So let's get into finding out more about you.

First of all, can you just give the listeners a bit of an introduction to your background, where you grew up, some of your experiences and the things that led you to have this passion for sustainability and the things that you do now?

So I was brought up in Malvern, in Worcestershire.

I went to Dyson Perrons School and then I left school and ironically started working as a teaching assistant at Dyson Perrons and then trained on the job, became a qualified teacher, was head of Pupil Premium.

Then from that job I went overseas and started leading expeditions.

I was based in the United Arab Emirates and led expeditions to East Africa, South America, Southeast Asia.

And then the pandemic happened and veg life was born.

Wow.

So there's a lot to unpack there.

It's quite the journey.

It's not your conventional journey, that's for sure.

Well, let's go back to your school days and I.

I've got a little note here from where I first spoke to you.

You said to me I was quite a determined and willful individual and also I was a.

How did you describe it?

A school refuser.

A school refusal.

Let's just unpick that a bit.

Let's talk about your willfulness and your school refusing.

So I wasn't a big fan of education when I was in it, but I was a very high achiever.

I was predicted a stars for all of my GCSEs.

So then it came to year 11.

I'd always been friends with older students and once they'd left, found myself a little bit on my own and so decided I didn't want to go to school, was a little bit naughty and played truant quite a lot.

And then eventually they found out and they caught on that it wasn't my mother phoning up school and saying I wasn't attending, it was in fact me.

And so it was agreed that I could see sit my exams remotely.

So I'd go in and collect work.

And then I studied at home and sat my exams, came out with some really good grades.

But it was great that then the journey was continued later on when I was 18 and ended up going back into the education sector.

And I could use my experiences to help students that were attending school at that time.

I could understand where they were coming from and I could make adjustments to help cater for their needs.

So you were able to empathize with their challenges?

Absolutely.

And also I was in a position I could facilitate support that wasn't available when I was at school.

So ironically, I was in charge of the school refusers of the school.

And so I'd quite often go out in the car and collect students that were refusing to come to school and I'd bring them in and we'd agree that they could sit with me in my classroom and they were attending school in that way and they'd get the work completed.

So.

Quite a proactive individual.

Would you describe yourself as?

I'd say so, yeah.

At what point did this passion that you've now got for sustainability start to come into your psyche?

So when I went overseas as traveling teacher to Tanzania, we went with a company called Camps International.

We went for four weeks and we started taking part in project work with a long lasting sustainable impact.

Yeah.

When I returned to the uk, I was actually at Heathrow Airport.

I remember it very vividly.

I emailed the Director of Africa and asked for a job.

He offered me a job there and then for a six month period.

But in the interim we decided that it was better suited for me to go and work in the United Arab Emirates office and be based there permanently.

But getting to see these projects that we're taking part in, getting to go and see different parts of the world, but also leaving behind a positive impact, that's where I really developed my passion for sustainability and saw that we as individuals can make an impact.

Do you think that was always in you, but this is just woken up in you?

I think so, yeah.

I think I implemented many things when I was working at Dyson Perrins.

I introduced meditation and mindfulness to the school.

So I think there was probably an underlying element there.

And the expeditions just really lit the sustainability side of things for me.

So going back to school, what made you want to introduce those kind of practices into school?

So when I started working at school, I was particularly with special educational needs students and I'd done a lot of research in how meditation was helping support these students, these needs.

And there was a student with Tourette's and ADHD that I'd worked with for a long time and he could complete a 20 minute meditation in silence and wouldn't have any tics, which was a huge accomplishment.

And it was also amazing to see for him that he, he could see that he was then in control of his tics in those moments.

And I think it's very powerful tool.

I think meditation and mindfulness can be really impactful for young people.

Is that something you still use now in your.

I do, yeah, for my own well being.

But I think it's probably the best time to introduce it.

Age of 15 or 16, if you can introduce those practices then become more natural.

Yeah.

And more embedded at an early age.

Which is really important.

You've had some incredible experiences working with these disadvantaged youth.

Maybe you can share a few stories of that.

I'm particularly interested in what those experiences taught you about resilience and empathy.

So rather naively, living in a small town, I wasn't aware of some of the issues that the students I was working with were facing and so cases of neglect and abuse.

And so it really opened my eyes to the world a little bit through that time that I spent working at secondary school to see what really goes on in the world, I suppose.

And the fact that you could help these people as well.

Yeah.

So to be in a position that I could offer pastoral care.

And I think it highlights actually what a teacher's role in a young person's life is.

It's more than just an educational sector.

They are there for a pastor or they're there as a parent figure sometimes.

Rich and I have talked about this before.

I think the life skills that you can teach kids at that age are as important as passing the exams, aren't they?

Yeah, I completely agree and I really glad that I went on the journey that I did and I didn't go down the conventional route of going to university, qualifying as a teacher, going in to be a teacher because I had a bit of life experience and I also just had a different approach to it.

It meant that I had a bit more freedom to do things differently and not do it in the traditional sense of the classroom sector.

So being able to teach a little bit of general life skills as well through my time there.

You sound like a person that doesn't want to do things necessarily through a traditional way.

You want a bit of freedom in your life is probably important.

I would say what I've said so far would give that impression.

That's formed part of where you are now, hasn't it, in terms of the things you're trying to achieve now, which we'll come on to.

Yeah, I think that's definitely implemented into the business.

And I don't think you need to follow the status quo all the time.

That's when great things are achieved, when you kind of deviate from the plan.

I got a note here that when you were 18, you had your own sort of battles with anxiety and depression.

I wonder if you could open up a bit about that and what you learned from that as well.

It's probably an aspect of why I am so strong willed now.

As I said, I didn't enjoy school.

I found it quite difficult and then got myself into a bit of a dark hole.

And then When I was 18, I was asked to leave college.

I was doing forensic science at college at the time, and the director of the course said, we're not.

We're not equipped to deal with someone with your needs.

And I said, what do you mean?

And he said, you're clearly depressed.

And so I was asked to leave the course at that point and wasn't in a very good place to be able to deal with it at the time.

But it's something that I reflect on quite often and probably in hindsight of why I went back into education and was so driven to help young people, because I think that's wrong.

I'd like to think that wouldn't happen nowadays.

This is 13, 14 years ago, so hopefully things have changed a little bit.

Yeah, it was a frustration, really, and it probably drove me a lot more in my first career because of that experience.

But having that sense of purpose of going back in and helping the other kids that were struggling, did that help you get over your own challenges as well?

Yes, I think so.

I mean, a sense of.

It was.

It made me realize that my issues, my problems in life, were probably not as bad.

When you were dealing with people, with students that are going through abuse and neglect, it puts things into perspective for.

You because we can very much get wrapped up in our own issues, our own problems, our own challenges.

But actually, like you said, there's a massive world out there and a lot of other people have got far worse challenges than we have, and you never.

Know what's going on behind closed doors.

I think that was the key message I got from the secondary school is you don't know what's going on in anybody's life, really.

No.

And the perspective thing is a huge.

I think the expeditions were a big impact for that because I went on a journey every time I went overseas on one of these trips.

But also the students that I took with me, it puts things into perspective to see how different people in the world live.

So I know when you went to Dubai and you took some groups to Borneo and other places, pretty big challenges rose up whilst you were there.

Do you want to share how you managed to rise to the challenge and be resilient in the face of adversity?

So my first expedition I led, I was 22.

I took a group of about 36 students to Borneo.

In the first week, I had a student attempt suicide.

In the third week, I had a student fall through the bamboo flooring and sever her finger.

So there was a few challenges along the way.

Finger particularly.

I don't think any amount of first aid training can prepare you for that.

First time you deal with a lot of blood, it's a shock to anyone.

I think you can't prepare yourself for that.

I was in a position, I was in charge of this, these group of students, I don't think they were aware of how young I was, but also because of my previous experience, I was a little bit wiser beyond my years, I'd say we had to just continue.

We were there for a purpose.

We were there to take part in some really impactful project work.

So that probably drove me further to continue because we saw, we saw firsthand how it was benefiting the local community or in the environment that drives you.

I think if you can see that you're making a positive difference.

Yeah, you continue with it.

I think being purpose driven when you are dealing with adversity and when you need to be resilient actually is really important, isn't it?

You've got to tap into something that motivates you to keep going.

Yeah, of course, yeah.

How did you cope with those?

More importantly, what did you learn from coping with those examples that you gave?

Because I'd gone straight to this trip from the school role, I was very much into mindfulness and meditation at the time.

And so that was my first port of call, was just kind of making sure I was in a calm state to be able to deal with the problems that were arising and also be able to pass some of that onto the students that were facing difficulties.

It did help calm the situation for sure.

So to create a bit more context, Rhianne, tell me a bit more about that role and why you were there and what you were trying to achieve.

What were the goals, what were the outcomes?

So it was an expedition leader role.

When I was in the United Arab Emirates, I was also operations, so I was organizing the trips, booking flights, doing medical reviews and all sorts.

But whilst we were on the ground in country, I was fortunate enough I spent a lot of time in Kenya and Tanzania.

I also led a trip to Uganda, Borneo, Cambodia, Ecuador and Galapagos.

Each of the projects were in line align with the UN Sustainable Development Goals and we'd also work with the community and local authorities to make sure that what we were doing was going to have a long lasting impact.

Nothing that we took part in was tokenistic and our CEO ensured that every project we started was completed.

He was ex army and he used to go and do training in Kenya and he'd see half built classrooms and he was frustrated by this.

So he made sure that everything that we started was completed.

And it ranged from educational.

So in Kenya, we had a big focus on education.

Every classroom that we built, the Kenyan government would provide a teacher for.

Whereas Borneo and Ecuador were much more reforestation heavy then.

We had a lot of wildlife conservation along the way, tending to water holes in national parks.

In Kenya, we actually got chased by a herd of elephants.

In Tanzania once we were doing a walking tour to go and do some maintenance on a watering hole.

And so all of the group had hoes and shovels in their hands and all of a sudden a herd of elephants crept up behind and we had to quickly get out of the way.

And it was quite a surreal moment as we were crouched down, hiding in the grass and there's the ranger in front loading his gun up.

And I thought, that's not really going to do anything.

If they decide to change direction and come towards us, we're all stood there with hoes and shovels.

There were some very surreal moments.

Or a student going out into the bush and seeing some eyes glowing back at them and it's a hyena and it's coming to camp was quite an experience.

The projects varied.

They were incredible.

And it was just amazing to immerse ourselves in local culture.

We got to go and work with the local communities and see how different people lived and cook and eat and the education system as well, how that differs in different regions of the world.

And is this the thing that really lit your fire to make a difference in other people's lives?

Because, I mean, the experiences sound amazing.

What the thing that comes across to me more than is you're there, as you said, to make a difference in their lives.

I would say so.

I think I learned through the UN Sustainable Development Goals.

I learned a lot about sustainability.

I probably would have been easily swayed to say, oh, it's about recycling stuff before, but actually it's so much more.

It's about having a sustainable planet for the environment and all of the inhabitants.

And it's about equal opportunities.

It's about so, so much more.

And I think I developed a passion to help people when I worked at the school.

But through these expeditions it broadened how we can have an impact not just for people, for the wildlife and for the environment.

Yeah, there's something like 17, isn't there?

Yes, 17.

I'm not sure how many leaders could tell you what those 17 are.

I'm not even sure I could reel them all off.

How important do you think leaders knowing about these things are and how you would apply them in your own world?

100%.

So actually I have a sustainability goal within my business plan and how we can implement.

And I think it's important that every leader understands them because if we don't change something, there isn't going to be the planet that we know for future generations.

And it gives a really clear overview of how we can implement change in different areas.

And it's applicable to every business.

I would say it's not just a food business thing.

I think you could do it in any sector.

You could look and see how it's applicable to your sector.

Yeah, no, I totally agree.

So my second point, and I think the really important one for leaders listening to this or anybody listening to this, is how do we start to bring those into our everyday?

So if there's a leader listening to, thinking.

Yeah, actually in my business, what could I do to support those 17 UN goals?

What would be your advice?

Because you said you put them into your business plan.

Yeah.

Well, I think that's how you should start.

So, on the website on the UN Sustainable Development Goals website or unscgs, you can read in depth each goal they've set aims between the next five years of what they want to achieve, to be able, able to see that we've got a sustainable future ahead of us.

So I think it's a good evaluation tool, really, to see what you're doing within your industry.

I think it's worth observing that it's not just the fact like the planet's going to disappear, it's going to get into a dire state and that's not going to be pleasant for anyone to be living through.

No, I totally agree.

And as a father of two girls, I do wonder what the future looks like for them and their kids as well.

And I think that was a big shocker.

I actually had that conversation with my parents a couple of years ago that I question whether I want to have children because right now I don't think that the planet's got a good future ahead of it.

And it makes those questions come into your mind, which probably drives me even more because if I'm considering whether I have children because of the dire state of the planet, then you've got to do something.

You're going to have to be proactive there.

So what shifted you after your experiences doing the expeditions, you then started a business.

Just talk about that transition from that World of doing all those great things around the world to coming back to Malvern and starting a business.

Yeah, it's quite a strange journey.

So I did lockdown over in Dubai, which was quite strict.

It's just a smooth transition.

And so I wanted to continue my passion for sustainability and thought better way than doing something with food.

It's actually the single biggest impact we as individuals can make what we consume.

It's something that we all have control over.

And so when I come back, I started to do takeaways from home.

Everything was plant based, but because I was introducing different cuisines that were not available in Malvern before, people were so fixated on these new flavors of Sri Lankan stews and East African curries that nobody noticed there was no meat involved.

And then there was a restriction in Covid.

I don't know if you remember that you couldn't get a pint at the pub without a substantial meal.

I do remember, yeah, very bizarre.

And so a Scotch egg was deemed a substantial meal.

And so my local pub didn't have a vegetarian option at the time.

And so rather selfishly, I said, you need to start having one.

They said, well, make us one.

So I created a plant based Scotch egg that resembles a traditional one in appearance, texture and taste and started selling it to them so that I could pint of the pub.

But what we found was they couldn't tell the difference.

They said, you know what, you couldn't tell that that's not a meat and egg, a meat and chicken egg, Scotch egg.

Let's just sell yours.

It reduces our risk of food waste.

We don't have to have a meat and a veggie option which won't tell anyone they're vegan.

And so I walked in the pub the one day and some old boys were sat at the bar saying, these Scotch eggs are fantastic, you've got to try that.

I said, I actually make them, they're plant based.

They said, what does that mean?

I said, there's no meat, there's no egg, they're fully vegan.

They said, I knew there.

But from there that was the light bulb moment of, okay, I've got a great product here.

If even these guys can enjoy it, then let's see where this goes.

Because I know how they're made.

I know that it's a much more sustainable route.

They're much more ethical.

They let the Pigs and chickens off Scotch free.

I love that.

I love that.

Say that again.

I love that they let the pigs and chickens off Scotch free.

How did you know where to start with making a meat free Scotch egg egg?

I just played around in the kitchen.

I looked at recipes.

I haven't been plant based all my life.

I used to make Scotch eggs myself.

I used to do a breakfast one with mushrooms and baked beans in it and bacon wrapped around the egg and then a sausage.

I've made Scotch eggs for years, so I knew how you make a traditional one.

I knew that the casing and the breadcrumbs was easy enough.

I just had to make the egg and so I did some research, I played around and did some experimenting and I came up with what I was satisfied with.

The texture of it as.

I think it's really important, especially with plant based food, you've got to get the texture right.

Yeah, yeah.

Well, as a fan of Scotch eggs, I have.

I'd like a nice Scotch egg.

I have tried, as you know, and you can't taste the difference and the texture is lovely.

And the great thing as well is nutritionally, they're superior.

So they have exactly the same amount of protein as a traditional Scotch egg.

They've got 7 grams less fat, a fifth less calories and there's no cholesterol.

Didn't you say also you've made.

How many Scotch eggs have you made in your mum's kitchen?

I made 10,000 from my mum's kitchen.

I've made 70,000 over the last three and a half years.

70,000 Scotch eggs?

Yeah, It's a lot.

And actually a lot of pigs and chickens.

You've written off Scotch free.

Yes.

So I made 10,000 in my mum's kitchen and I catered five weddings from there.

So she was very glad when I decided to move out.

Let's move on to your business that you've now got.

Veg life.

What were the biggest challenges that you faced in the early days of setting that up?

I would say I was winging it because when I set it up it was still.

We were still in pandemic mode.

The UK was in the third lockdown and so there's a lot of services available for people that are starting new businesses.

But they were always in person before COVID So now it's great.

There's lots of resources available online, but there wasn't at this time that I started.

So it meant I had to do a lot of research myself in figuring out a route to market and how I Grow a business.

I mean, this was such a novelty to me.

I'd never done anything like it before, knew about it.

I had to quarantine.

When I first came back to the UK and I wrote my business plan in the first three days, I think of quarantine and I think if I hadn't have had that and out of boredom then I probably wouldn't have gone forward with it.

It made me stop and go, right, think about this, how are you going to make a business?

So you obviously saw the quarantine and obviously the lockdown is an opportunity.

Yeah.

So when I first came back, that lockdown, three of the biggest events in the hospitality calendar, Mother's Day, Easter and Valentine's Day, people couldn't go out for a meal.

So I offered people meals on wheels, a three course meal at home and I approached a local restaurant, asked if I could do it out of their kitchen at the time.

So we made over 100 meals and went out delivering them.

And it's funny to think the amount of people that had zoom calls and enjoyed a three course meal over a video call, which seems bizarre to think of now, but so many people did it at the time and it was because there was that gap I identified, nobody else was doing it.

And these are events that people usually go out for a meal over.

So that kick started the business really to be able to offer something different.

So you were obviously great at seeing an opportunity and not everybody is great at seeing opportunities.

They don't see the opportunity that also presents itself as well.

You did, but there must have been challenges that you had to overcome.

Yeah, more for when I was growing it.

So initially the first year was a dream really.

I, I really enjoyed it and because I was doing it from my parents kitchen, there wasn't a lot of overheads so there was less risk factor.

But as I began to scale it, it's.

It was apparent that a lot of capital is needed to grow a business.

I wasn't aware of how much you need really to start from a starting point.

Everything requires copper costs to set up and because I was off electoral whilst I worked overseas and whilst I was at the secondary school, I was on a good salary, always had good savings, never went overdrawn, was brought up, if you don't have it, you don't spend it.

So never had any credit history.

So then when I tried to get a loan for the business, it was all based off my personal credit score.

So I haven't been able to access any private funding to grow the business.

And without capital, you can't access grant funding.

So all of the local authority and government grants are match based fund match based basis.

So you pay up front and they reimburse you, which is brilliant.

And it's great that there's those initiatives available, but unless you have capital, you can't access them.

So how did you overcome that then?

Because that's a big barrier to setting up a business and trying to do what you were trying to do.

It's meant I've just had to thrift my way through the last three years.

I've completely bootstrapped the business.

I've catered a lot of weddings to pay for the progression of the business.

I also did lots of pop up supper clubs and private dining in people's homes.

It's great that I've had those opportunities to bring extra streams of revenue in, but it has detracted me from the main objective of the business.

Yeah.

So maybe it's taken a little bit longer than it had have been if I had been able to access funding at the start.

But at the same time I think the business wouldn't have developed the way it has because of doing it that way.

So what are the lessons as a leader you've learned?

Having to grow the business that way.

So there's a song by Chumbawamba called Tum Thumping.

I don't know if you're familiar with it.

I remember it well.

Get knocked down, but I get back up again.

And I think that is the biggest motivation for me is that you have to just keep going.

There's an analogy someone taught me very early on about drilling for oil.

That you could be drilling for oil and you could be half an inch from the oil and if you walked away, you wouldn't get to the oil and you'd never know.

But if you keep drilling, you might reach the oil, you might not, you might never reach it.

But how will you know if you walk away at that point?

That's a real key for me of going, you need to keep going.

There's been times, don't get me wrong, that I've gone, why am I doing this?

Yeah, I don't want to do this anymore.

But get back up, keep going.

Because you, it might just be just around the corner.

That big oil break, is that where.

The sense of purpose comes in?

What gets you back up when you fall down is that I'm doing this for a reason.

Absolutely.

The why is my driving factor.

The business has given me a platform that I can do more than just make great tasting food products.

Yeah.

I've started my own community fridge in Malvern.

I've been able to go into schools and do educational talks on sustainability and entrepreneurship, which I would never been able to do if I didn't have the business as that platform.

Those are the motivating factors for me that I'm able to make a difference as well as through the environmental factors of the products to just the basis of being a plant based product.

There's huge benefits, but that it's also facilitated these other opportunities within the community for me.

So is there anything else you'd say to any aspiring leaders or leaders that are out there who want to create a really positive impact in the world but are facing challenges or self doubt?

What would your advice to them be?

Try and look at it from a different perspective, I suppose.

I think I'm a prime example of you don't have to go down the written path, you don't need to go down the conventional route all the time.

Sometimes there's a different avenue you could go to get there.

And do you have a team now?

So is it just you or I presume you have a team?

Yes.

So we've got a team in the production.

We have subcontractors that come and work on a freelance basis and come and get involved when we've got big orders in.

My dad got made redundant from Morgan Motors the same week I did.

So the natural progression from building cars is to build Scotch eggs obviously.

Yeah, of course.

So he helps in the production as well.

And then we've got other lads that come and make the eggs as well.

But we're just going through a scale up process so it's really exciting time to, to grow the team and I'm really looking forward to that opportunity.

So how do you keep a team of people motivated in what is a purpose driven business?

Because I imagine a lot of the work they have to do is quite repetitive as well.

Oh gosh, yeah.

Yeah.

Well, in the kitchen we're motivated by food and dancing.

Yeah.

Some of the aspects of the production are a bit mundane and repetitive.

So we quite often blast music out and it's.

Every day is different then because you don't know what you're going to dance around the kitchen to.

But we've also had work placements, we've been able to facilitate work placements for young adults.

We had a young lad go through rehabilitation with us and I think that helps motivate the team as well because they see the opportunities that we're able to present.

As well.

Okay.

So you're surrounding yourself with people who believe in some of the stuff that you believe in.

Yes.

I would say that we've all got aligned values within our team, and I don't think it would work if you didn't see the values of veg life similar or aligned with your own.

I don't think you'd want to work there.

And I've not actually done any recruitment so far.

It's always been through people that we know or have approached us that want to get involved in the business, which I think speaks volumes.

Yeah, absolutely.

And I guess the challenge is when you do have to go and recruit people maybe that you don't know, is to make sure you keep that.

Yeah, that feel.

Yeah.

And then I think my experience with the expedition will come into play there because.

Because I don't think you could do a conventional interview process with this to find out if you had aligned values.

I remember when we doing training for expedition leaders, because can't prepare yourself, like we said before, the scenarios that you can encounter, you could never prepare yourself for every eventuality.

No Reading risk assessments of what happens if Somalian pirates enter camp or wild animals, you can read all the risk assessments you want.

But in practicality, when you face those challenges, how.

How do you overcome them?

And I think the same for if anyone new comes into the business, they'd have to experience it and.

And see the vision to be able to get on board.

I don't think it would be appropriate if someone didn't believe in our missionaries.

I think if you're going to build a business, bringing people into that business that share your purpose, share your values is really important because that's how you get past the tougher times, isn't it?

And I think it's testament to us that, that the young people that have come through and done work placements have asked to be involved further down the line or have gone away and done something in a similar ethos.

So I think that speaks volumes, that if you can create that environment that people pick up on it just by being in there.

So what next for Veg Life, then?

So you've taken us up to where you are now.

What's the next part of the journey?

So we're scaling, really.

We have a production site at the Hot Pocket in Bishop's Room, affectionately called Cluckingham Palace.

And so we're now looking.

So for the last 18 months, I've been meeting lots of buyers in different industries and there's been significant interest expressed in the Products.

So we now need to scale up to be able to adhere to these bigger contracts.

We were awarded the UK Food and Drink Startup of the Year last year, which has given us a really good steed for moving forward.

And what about 10 years from now?

Where do you see your ambition 10 years from now?

Now my personal ambition is I'd like to have a safari lodge in 10 years time.

Oh, wow.

I'd like to go full circle and go back to Kenya.

Would you?

Yeah.

And have sustainability driven again.

You know, offer people that experience of luxury, of infinity pools in a safari lodge.

But also around the back you've got basic camping where people can still go and experience that, but give back in community projects and immersing into the culture.

I think quite often people assume donations have to be monetary.

It can be your time.

There's so many other ways that you can help other people.

It doesn't always have to be monetary.

On a local community basis, it could be as simple as having a conversation with your neighbor.

Your neighbor could be quite lonely and you taking five minutes to have a conversation would make the world of difference to them.

Or you making dinner and having some leftovers rather than throwing it in the bin, boxing it up and offering it to a neighbour.

Those small gestures can go such a long way.

Yeah.

So, Rhianne, the Scotch eggs, Scotchy as they, as you call them, absolutely gorgeous.

What else do you make?

So the Scotch eggs are kind of what got our foot in the door, really, the familiarity of them.

They're what people recognize.

It's opened so many more opportunities.

We've got a whole range.

We do pastries and honeycomb Tiffin and whole eggs and egg mayo as well.

But we also diversified last year and started supplying a company called the Beefy Boys with some products.

Actually, the subject line of our email chain is the combination you wouldn't expect on paper.

The Beefy Boys and Veg life.

Yeah, we found that our revenue from markets and events started to go down a little bit last year.

It wasn't quite where it was the previous years.

So we were trying to look at another stream of revenue coming in.

And I'd met the Beefy Boys, one of the founders, Murph, at an event and he'd said, what you up to these days?

And told him, and he said, jack, and you could make us some veg burgers.

And so I developed a patty for them.

We went backwards and forwards, changed the flavor profile, changed, manipulated the texture slightly.

And so we've supplied them with over 5,000 patties.

Over the last few months and they're selling really well.

But what's great as well is that they're looking to diversify.

When they have a table of 10, there might be one veggie and they want to have a great option for that one person.

It's amazing how collaborations can come around and that they saw that they needed to diversify and they needed to have a better offering.

So why not bring in someone that specializes in that food sector?

So it's been a really good partnership between us and they're doing exceptionally well.

They've got a restaurant in Hereford, Cheltenham and Shrewsbury and they're just opening Bath this week.

Oh, wow.

So they're growing really, really rapidly.

So it's nice to be able to go on that journey with them.

And do you think collaboration is going to be part of your future growth journey?

I think so.

And I think that is testamen to that.

We're not the conventional plant based food company because some other companies maybe would say, oh, you wouldn't, you shouldn't work with them because they're against your ethics.

They're.

They're selling meat.

Yeah.

Actually beefy boys have quite similar values on sustainability.

They, where they source all of their produce from is very local.

Right.

And they get all of their beef from Herefordshire farmers.

They know exactly where their produce is coming from.

So ironically they, although they're a very different product, they have similar values in that sense, making sure it's the most ethical source that they can.

They can source.

Yeah.

And I think you make a really interesting point there about, you know, well, why are you working with them there?

To meet products.

But actually sustainability is a quite a nuanced conversation.

It's not a black and white, either it's this or it's that, is it?

There's a whole lot of nuance in this that people need to understand and embrace.

Absolutely.

And I don't think it's sustainable.

If everyone went vegan tomorrow, if everyone cut out all animal products, it wouldn't be sustainable for the planet either.

No, it's about me being more conscientious of what we're consuming.

Just taking a moment to think about where our food source is coming from.

I think I was fortunate because when I lived in Dubai I did that because everything's imported there.

You don't grow produce.

I'm lucky that at home in Malvern I grow a lot of vegetables myself.

But you can't in the desert.

It's not the greatest climate for it.

So everything's imported there.

So it makes you more conscientious of where everything's sourced from.

One last thing I wanted to pick up.

You mentioned before about your plans to establish a foundation and the community projects are part of that.

So just want to talk about that a bit more for us.

Yeah.

So I see that there's huge market opportunity for the business.

Honest.

I've had great industry recognition.

We've been fortunate enough to win a few awards and to have some big boys, you know, of the food game, to show interest in stocking our products.

So I can see that there's a.

There is a huge potential for this business to grow and so I don't want to lose my.

Why?

The reason I started this is to make a positive impact and like I said before, it's facilitated doing community projects.

I don't ever want to lose that for where the commercial journey goes on.

And so I feel the best way to secure that is a foundation.

Yeah, it can mean that a percentage of our profits can go to support that foundation.

Feeds in really nicely with the business as well.

So our packaging we use for the Scotch Ease is fully home compostable.

We've actually found that the oils that we use for frying the Scotch eggs in speeds up the decomposition process, but they're the perfect size as a plant pot, so you could actually use it to plant a sapling in it.

And as the plant grows, the packet will decompose.

So you could actually just plop the packet into the ground and it will fully decompose and it will add some nutrients to the soil as the plant grows.

The foundation can help support some reforestation projects that I'm passionate about on a larger scale that we maybe wouldn't been able to implement from a business level, but from a foundation point of view and we'll be able to support bigger initiatives.

So, Rhianne, I have to say, talking to you today, I am totally inspired by you.

Thank you.

Just to summarise some of the key things I think I've picked up from talking to you today.

The importance of a values and purpose driven business and getting your whole team on board with that and making sure you've got the right people that share that is so important.

I love the way you talked about collaboration and maybe not the obvious collaboration, but maybe looking for collaborations that can take you in a different direction.

And on the resilience side, I love the way that you talked about challenge what you think, you know, go and do some research, find out things that maybe you don't know that might be Useful and use that to widen your perspective.

I think these are all really brilliant lessons for any leader.

Whatever they do.

Yeah.

And that's what I'm taking away from this today.

What would your top two or three tips for leaders be based on what you've experienced, what you've learned?

I just say for carrying on from that.

I think that's been a huge asset for me is the research.

I have gone away.

It's meant I've spent many evenings watching YouTube videos of Scotch egg factories, which is probably not the rock and roll lifestyle I was hop.

But research is so.

So key.

Can find out so much more and look at things from a different perspective.

If you go away and do your homework.

I go back to Chumbawamba.

I think it's a key thing.

Not just because of all the drinks that he lists.

That you could help get you through those challenging times, but also you need to get back up and go again.

There's nothing too big that should keep you flawed.

And you need to find a support network if that's the case that you find that you are.

Do you do keep getting flawed.

How you bounce back.

Yeah.

But trust as well.

I think trust is really, really important.

I think you need to make sure that your team earn it as well.

I've probably learned over the last three years I give out trust a little bit too easily sometimes.

So that's really key to ensure that you've built it.

And also ask.

That's been probably my biggest success is going to networking events and to ask people.

I've not been too frightened.

And my friend always laughs that I went up to a Har harrodsbio and my first trade show and got them to try some Scotch eggs.

Because nothing phases me.

Why should we be phased by the bigger things?

All they can say is no.

Exactly.

So you might as well try.

But always remember, if someone promises you the world, it's probably too good to be true.

Good advice.

Be brave.

But be realistic.

Yeah.

And if people want to find out more about you and what you do, where do they go?

Yeah.

So I'm.

I'm always happy to help.

If anyone out there has any questions about sustainability or anything, I'm always happy to chat.

But our website's www.veglifeats.com and we're on social media at Veglife Eats.

Lovely.

And those links will be in our podcast.

Amazing as well.

Well, Rhianne, thank you so much for your time today.

You are an inspiring, amazing woman.

I hope you go on sort of massive success in the future, we'll be certainly be following your journey and we will be eating your Scotch eggs.

Rich is here in the background producing today.

I'm sure he's dying to get stuck into your Scotch eggs, but thank you so much, and I hope that people listening to this find you as inspiring as I do.

Thank you.

Thank you for having me.

You're welcome.